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Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums! Retraining the Western Pleasure Horse. Posts Latest Activity. Page of 3.

Filtered by:. Previous 1 2 3 template Next. Retraining the Western Pleasure Horse Apr. I have just started riding a horse that was trained for western pleasure.

When I ask her to do a circle she moves away from my leg instead of bending around my leg. While she is doing this she is not looking where she is going, we have gotten pretty close to rubbing the jumps in the arena.

She is a sweet willing mare just a little confused right now with what I am asking. How can I help her to understand what I am asking?

Dawn Patience and Consistency are Your Friends. Tags: None. What kind of bit are you using, and how are you using your reins when you are riding the circle?

Comment Post Cancel. D ring snaffle and I open my inside rein. Today when I rode I used a little pressure with my outside leg and this helped tremendously.

If this is a well trained western horse, then she will be more accustomed to bending from your outside rein aid. Instead of using a leading inside rein, keep your hands in a normal position, but slightly elevate your outside rein while using your inside leg.

On the circle, you need to work inside leg to outside rein. This means that the outside rein must be effective, and that you should have less contact on the inside rein.

On the straight line, you would be working more with that slight lift on the inside rein, and the greater use of your outside leg position.

See how that works for you. Lambie Boat. I have an ex-Western Pleasure horse that is currently in his third week of living at a dressage barn I did hunters with him in the late fall when I got him, and then for all intents and purposes he had the winter off.

The biggest challenges for him have been to accept and seek a firmer contact, and that when asked for 'more' in the trot he quickly offers up the canter instead.

I have not tried to figure out his 'western pleasure' buttons, but have rather focused on saying, "These are the new buttons. I am trying to get a good video of him; tragically the tape ran out yesterday three minutes before the horse gave me the best canterwork he's ever done for me.

Enjoy your WP horse and don't let anyone talk down to him because of his heritage. My dressage trainer is a huge fan of my WP pleasure horse and I have three horses, the other two are a TB and an Oldenburg and loves to teach Jinxy lessons because he is so freakin' adorable and always tries tries tries.

Slow down and put in new buttons One advantage of retraining a WP pleasure horse is that they typically know how to accept correction. They are used to being told what to do, and will generally try and try.

It's true that your mare has probably been taught to turn but not bend according to outside rein, perhaps outside leg.

If so, you need to teach her that bending while turning is the New Correct. Assume she just doesn't know and would oblige if the understood what you wanted and was physically strong enough to do it.

WP horses are also typically taught to listen to rein and leg separately. So while keeping their body pretty straight, they will "side pass"-- a leg yield done directly sideways just off your leg alone.

They will also do turns on the haunches sort of, by dressage standards primarily off your hand. The good news in all this is that if you slow down, use leg and hand in different combinations at the walk, your mare will figure out what you want.

If this horse were mine, I'd start with the reminder that she needs to move her hind end away from leg pressure. Then, in my snaffle and not worrying about the contact, I'd use a direct rein, perhaps raised up pretty high and ask her for a turn on the fore hand, with her nose bent in.

One or two steps with her hind end, and we relax and walk straight. If you see the logic of my idea, you can build to get any degree of bend from there with spirals on a circle, whatever.

I'd worry about getting her to understand what you want her to do with her body and how she should listen to your hand and leg first.

I'd worry about the quality of her bends and acceptance of contact later. It will take her some time to get strong enough to do all this well.

But if you can enjoy watching her learn, you will be able to continue to enjoy her. She can do it, and the horse who knows how to be trained is a joy to ride.

Maybe you should trde in your Pinto Wagon for something a little more expensive than your horse. In watching some of these riders in the video, I can say this, a lot of them are way behind their horses!

I have been showing horses for a long time and had to get out of the Pleasure industry. Mainly because, the horses all move around the arena and they have a defeated look on their faces.

I have not been back to the Congress in several years for that reason and I have quit training pleasure horses all together.

I will say that I have notice on the videos of this particular show, while the horse do not look defeated, and they have a nice steady forward movement.

They are still very heavy on the forehand, and that is a result of the riders being behind in the hores gait.

Not a major problem and easily fixed, if you so choose to do so. IT does not matter how expensive or how well trained the horse, if the rider is not their, then, that can paint a lousy picture!

Wow, mouse are you really taking this as a personal attack? Come on, if you're going to poke fun at people, quite maliciously I might add, you have to be willing to take some flack when its undeserved.

You were absolutely brutal in your condemnation, on split second photographs of people. Then when people took offence to that and commented, it was ok when it was just me - because it was just one or maybe two little nobodies.

But then when a large group found out and wanted to defend itself - you go snarky? Come on, you have be a bit more professional than that.

The fact that you always seem to post within a few moments of each other, have similar writing styles, and the same hot-headedness are great cause for speculation Hmm, does that mean that you and the rest of the blabbers on PHF are all the same person, just using multiple IDs?

You've all bitched about the same damn thing. You all make the same grammatical errors, you all whine in the same monotonous tone, must mean you're all the asme person.

Makes sense and gives me comfort to think there isn't an entire group that stupid, it's just one person. And Ann is an idiot. She belongs to my policits yahoo lists and is a proponent of tail blocking and drugging.

So if she's your shining example of the WP industry then Heaven help all of you. I would just like to know why everyone is having such a shit fit that the way classes are pinned is so rediculous anymore?

The only thing I can figure is you have sunken a ton of money into subscribing to the new lowered standards of equitation and horsemanship.

Seriously people. Have any of you seen a horse in the wild or one in pasture for that matter, that lopes along or shuffles I should say, so slowly that you can't tell if it is walking, jogging or loping?

How many of the 'wild horses' have you seen shuffling along like that to get away from a predator? With it's nose to the ground the whole time?

With a puffy full tail that never moves? And for anyone to claim their horse cast more than someone elses car is just arrogant and ignorant.

The horse doesn't care, the judges don't care unless they had a hand in the sale and neither does anyone else.

Your statement exclaims rich and stupid. Two traits that when combined, all these no talent hacks who call themselves 'trainers', love to see in their barn.

Sad fact- it does not matter what you paid for the horse, if you cannot ride, you cannot ride. Snaffles said: Come on, you have be a bit more professional than that.

Considering the source. PHF is a forum for loosers, indigents, and ass kissers. Wow, how come you excuses for human excrement are so obsessed.

It is not humanly possible for Snaffles to have an independent thought that doesn't involve stalking, and rabid finger pointing.

Really, really creepy. Not the first time for her either. Now Snaffles why don't we talk about what's wrong in the WP show ring I'd certainly be more than happy to talk about training and technique instead of your simpering moronic finger pointing obsession.

Rabbit, thanks for having the cajones to come here and state your case in a sane, adult manner!! It's nice to work hard toward a personal goal.

All this personal sniping I just had to scroll through it. I must say that the HUS horses in the video DO look waaay downhill, noodly-legged, and as if they couldn't possibly see over a 3' fence, much less haul themselves over it.

Why is it that when there IS an over-fences class, they sort of let the horse look around? And then when they're back to a flat class, they make them hang their heads on a straight neck?

And all this worrying about where the nose is in relation to "the vertical"? It's just so unnatural, and the weird equitation doesn't lend itself to a realistic, cadenced, active way of going.

It's so against everything I've ever been taught or read about real I mean, I guess if it's ALL you've ever seen Thank you, thank you, thank you!

You are entirely correct. Good riding helps facilitate good movement. Poor movement can also bring down good riding.

So is the lack of equitation in the pleasure ring the case of poor riding? Or is it the case of artificial movement creating a poor ride?

I tried to show some sort of professionalism on this new blog. But Fuck It! I hate watching the pleasure classes anymore. It is like watching snails fuck!

Just suuuuuuuuuuuuuper sloooooooooooow and so boring. And why oh why do they have fake tails. Hell if my hores cost more than my fuckin car, I would want him to have a real tail.

Seems someone got ripped off! And why do they cut the tails off strait at the bottom. No wonder those poor horse look defeated as I stated earlier.

They are worried that the fake tail makes their asses look big! And that is hunter? There again, there is so much wrong with the way those horses are moving.

I agree with you Cattypex, there is no way in hell they are going to make it over a 3'fence much less make it over cross rails or even a ground pole!

Once again, this is human beings sharing their sense of vanity with an animal! Next thing ya know, we will be putting breast implants in mares.

I am suprised someone has not thought of that for halter! Fucking stupid people! That is why we train cutting horses. There is none of that fake shit.

Trojan, SO is all you have to say? Yeah, the image of my non-abused, content pleasure horse DOES ruin the image of this ridiculous blog.

But if I was, I sure would defend it if I felt it needed defending. Not ALL people who show pleasure abuse there horses. Again, that just ruins your image of this blog.

So please, stop assuming. You're making an ass out of yourself. And you're right, nobody put a gun to my head and read your moronic prose about the numerous problems with the industry.

I just come here to get a nice little laugh, but you keep saying the same things over and over and over with people proving you wrong in the process.

Maybe it's time for you to stop bitching and actually DO something. Hey TJM! This is OT, but check this out! She is bred for an October foal ugh!

Y'know, I guess that's not a rhetorical question. How many of you HUS stock horse people use them? I'd like to know that.

ANY horse. I could even excuse fake tails at that point. I use cavaletti quite often. I think most people do the ones that do HUS that I know, anyways.

I use trotting grids and cavaletti as part of my own training routine off and on. I honestly think before you attack and degrade something, maybe try it first?

I'd love to have one of you come out and try one of my huntseaters. You might be surprised with how they ride. I talked a die-hard dressage acquaintance of mine to come try one of mine and she was amazed at how light and easy she was to ride, and how much drive and power she had when she moved.

It's a lot of fun. These horses may not be your cup of tea, but if you watch them at liberty you can't deny this is what they were bred and born to do.

I guess I never saw the opurpose in degrading a discipline that may not be your style or to your liking.

We all have preferences and opinions about what we like, but there isn't any reason to be nasty about the things that aren't our 'thing'. Then you need to get ot more.

One even had his professional horseman's card pulled because of it, and was reciprocally suspended from other horse associations.

Abuse happens. The horses that you can tell are drugged because they have no pupil response. I've seen people icing their horse's sides trying to get spur welts to go down.

If you're not seeing the abuse it's because you're not looking for it, or you're ignoring it. I don't think anyone has degraded the horses. I've had good pleasure horses and I used to spend a lot of my time creating good western riding and trail horses.

I know how a good pleasure horse moves and what they can do. What I don't like is the way SOME trainers do things to create poor frames, convex backs and lack of impulsion.

I think most pleasure horses are started way to young, and the plethora of hock injuries is bearing this out.

I don't think people criticize a section of the industry just for something to do, I think they do it because they want to see change and they're unhappy with the way things are.

I'd be more than happy to show in WP again, but I'm not going to compromise my horses legs, or mind to do so. Why browbeat her into one event, when I can get her to naturally do ten others?

Rabbit, Thanks for answering my non-rhetorical question, and thanks for actually jumping. I was really confused as to why the fairly correct movement and carriage I saw when the horses actually jumped did NOT carry over to the flat portion of the class.

The aim of the class is to have a horse that could jump a natural obstacle or three at any given moment. That was how I and countless others were taught, and it just FLOORS us, to this day, that the incorrect QH huntseat style that got popular in the mid 80s actually got worse and worse over the next 20 years.

There's no doubt that some of those horses could REALLY move out and look pretty if they'd get off their forehands, engage their hindquarters, look around, and git-a-goin.

Cattypex- I have to agree with you. The horses would be much more appealing across the board, if they were allowed to move out properly.

As for the riders, well posting at a normal trot, or even a working trot becomes far easier as the horse helps lift you out of the saddle as they push off and forward.

And can be mature adults about discussing things too I too, have to scroll past all the sniping and spewing. Really folks! You all want to keep showing horses moving like that, fine by me.

As for the ' put up or shut ups ', aimed at Trojan Mouse, or the ' instead of bitching about it DO something She is writing the blog, featuring photo's and pointing out what is wrong with each one!

Talk about a DUH! When she posts anything new, you all get your panties in a wad, start throwing insults and threats and everything goes to shit.

Grow up for dog sakes. What is overabundant here Arizona is the jerk and jab method. Horses who are not built for the job at hand are entered into everything across the board.

They are overworked in the warmup arena, then shown. If the placing isn't what the rider expects- it is not uncommon for them to take the horse out into the warmup arena and either work them over or work them into the ground.

And WHAT is up with the horse being way behind the verticle yet riding with droopy reins? Where is the contact, the soft following hands or the sensitive almost invisible communication they provide when done correctly?

I have yet to see a working hunter let alone a dressage horse, work on such droopy reins. In fact it is often the opposite in the dressage arena where rolkur is used or the riders tend you hang on their horses faces.

Where did the impulsion go? So many horses we see, move as if they are robotical in their efforts. They lack any form of drive, either from behind or in their mind.

The don't look like they are having any fun at all, just plowing along trying not to get jabbed, poked, prodded or jerked on.

How is that a pleasure class? Who is getting any pleasure out of that? Certainly not the horses. Certainly not the riders who are overfocused on every step and when to jab or jerk the horse again and whether or not the judge is watching We have also seen horses in the ring who were visibly LAME.

SO lame you could spot it across the arena. Yet instead of being excused, they are often times rewarded with a ribbon.

On another high note for the industries- a frined of mine was doing a catalog photo shoot with a girl who was a high point rider of some sort within her breed group I think it was APHA for HUS.

My friend asked her how high the fences are that they jump in competition? There is no jumping. Then why is she riding HUS? Because the tack is cheaper?

The breeches flatter her ass better than jeans do? Oops those should've been in italics, not quotes. They should be sympathetic, soft and yielding, like holding fragile squirmy baby birds.

Those reins should be a 2-way telegraph with your horse's mouth. There is no crime in not jumping. I don't see why this is such a horrendous thing.

Most western riders don't cut cattle or work the ranch the origins of western riding. Most Tennessee Walker riders aren't overseeing their slaves on the plantation.

Most dressage riders aren't going into battle. I don't see a problem with anyone enjoying their discipline as they like it. As long as the horses or humans aren't being harmed, what's the big deal if this specific discipline isn't ridden or exhibited exactly the same as a working hunter or as a dressage horse?

It's a totally different discipline. Not wrong, just different. While I definitely don't deny there are idiot riders and trainers out there in every discipline every part of life has it's idiots, it seems!

Those of us who DON'T jab our horses continuously with spurs Corky would toss me to the ground and then stomp me to death for that offense!!!

Not all of my horses have the talent or desire to jump. They all get tried over fences, some make it, some never go beyond crossrails.

It's really not that big a deal, is it? Please understand this: in my discipline AQHA hunter under saddle , my horse is bred and built and trained to go on minimal contact, stretching her neck long and straight, stretching her legs for optimum stride while keeping a slow, steady tempo.

It's not working hunter, it's not dressage, it's not western pleasure. Comparing it to any of those and saying it is wrong because it is different is just another way of trying to force everyone into one single mold.

I enjoy discussing my discipline and other disciplines with people who can keep an open mind and understand that while we all do things differently and ride differently, in the end we all love our horses and love what we are doing I hope!

CP- Centered Riding is indeed a good book. I also found Common Sense Dressage insightful and helpful, but books only take us all so far Being on the horse and DOING by riding, while being coached by someone with a good eye, solid techniques and tons of knowledge is always best, IMO at least.

Having someone videotape you for a see for your self, kind of thing is also very helpful. Rabbit- I can understand horses who have no talent for jumping, not jumping.

That would just be cruel to them and setting yourself up for failure if not injuries too. I can also understand not jumping the horses until they are mentally and physically ready for it.

Flat classes until then- totally understandable and completely acceptable. What I beleive the girl was stating was that her breed and the whole hunter division within it, offered no jumping classes.

Seems kinda weird for a hunter division Because that rider is an ignorant fuck who can't make her horse go around properly on the flat, much less over a jump.

The reason that I don't jump is simple. I have a fear of going down over a fence again and it is so bad that I simply cannot commit to going over a fence.

Not because I can't or my horse can't, I just don't enjoy it and avoid it like the plague. Sometimes there are other underlying reasons for not doing said thing.

Jumping isn't the end all-be all to riding English. Keep it up!!! I still have a huge, HUGE problem with "hunters" moving like that.

If you ever go to a hunter show, you'll see what I mean. That's my entire beef with that whole scene. Oh, and all of the shortcut "training methods" that a lot of unscrupulous people use.

I still go to a show every now and then, it's good to keep up with both sides of the hunt seat coin, so to speak. One of my nicest hunters as in over-fences was a super HUS horse.

When you pointed him at a working hunter course, he could lift up and go. Last I heard he was kicking butt at east coast hunter shows.

He was versatile enough to be able to show in a low, level, flat frame and also a more elevated traditional hunter frame.

There are a lot of horses showing both at the QH shows still, they are the best example of breed versatility. I guess what I don't understand is why anyone would have a 'beef' with the way something is done.

If it isn't hurting the horse or rider, why does it matter if a certain group of horses do things a certain way that is different from what you are used to?

Catty, I take it you ride over fences? Do you ride with someone in Richmond? I am in dire need to further my education over fences.

I am at a point in my life where I feel my abilities in that area have stagnated and I really need to get some better education than what i've had up till this point.

Well, I am I am a middle aged "re-rider" who finally found a decent affordable venue that fits my schedule. I used to ride pretty much every minute that I could, back when I had a horse!!!

Really, this low frame downhill thing has only been around for 25 years or so. It represents a devolution of effective equitation. I ride at the college where I work, and last semester ended up doing ground poles, so maybe I'll get over some baby 18" things by Christmas.

I can also picture myself getting the giggles and not being able to do it. Rabbit- I am not sure which breed assoc, or circuit the girl was refering to as my friend was the one who spoke to her.

My friend however, is very involved with sport horses, dressage, hunters etc. She was floored when the girl said there was no jumping classes offered.

It doesn't make a whole bunch of sense that way For the horses who are shown in that division, whether or not they actually jump, they should at least look like they can.

I agree that jumping isn't the be all end all to riding. We had a dressage client who felt dressage was everything and nothing else was 'worthy'.

That narrow mindedness is annoying to everyone else around you at best, and sort of limits your enjoyment of horses alltogether. Pregnancy hormones and paint fumes aren't a good combo when thinking is required or involved.

Even horses bred from generations of 'cow horses', may not have a lick of sense, ability or desire when it comes to cows. WP did stem from the cowboys and their working horses, but my biggest issue with WP as we know it today, is that it is so far removed from what a true 'western pleasure horse' is.

How many cowboys would have gotten anything done, jogging or loping along like that, while checking fence lines or riding out to check grazing lands, herds or anything else?

I too, like an easy going, ground covering jog that won't jar every bone in my body, or a casual lope rather than my horse racing off at top speed, but what is seen in the ring and often placed is quite the extreme opposite.

The horse should cover some ground, not shuffle along doing no more than going up and down in place like a carousel mount, or a quarter machine in front of the drugstore.

Huntseat rider- I get your fear issue. Believe me I do! My mare will jump 4'. I feel absolutely no need to go that high. She can do it, I'm the one who is chicken shit about it.

I haven't come off over a fence, but I know it will happen someday When your horse is already taller than you are, which my mare is and I am 5'2 why add the extra height in there to fall from?

Crazy fact of it is, I can come off going over even a smaller jump and land wrong, getting just as hurt, if not more, in the whole process.

It's not the falling part that hurts- it's hitting the ground! And I am with you on not wanting to do that any time soon, from any gait, fences involved or not.

Cut n Jump- "Have any of you seen a horse in the wild or one in pasture for that matter, that lopes along or shuffles I should say, so slowly that you can't tell if it is walking, jogging or loping?

It isn't like just grabbing any horse and making it move the way the western pleasure horse does, these horses are bred and raised and TRAINED to do so.

You obviousley cannot take a WILD HORSE off of the range and make it do these things, you also couldnt take a wild horse and expect it to survive being stalled up and pampered over I don't like it.

Just like I don't like tailset thingies on saddlebreds, rolkur in dressage, crazy saddleseat monsters, fatass halter horses, or jawcracking bits on cross country horses.

Sure, we all do "unnatural" things with show horses, but sometimes folks just go too far. Lopinslow- Have any of those horses actually been bred to move this way?

Are you asking about the wild horses or any other horse in particular? Make it move that way, not so much. If you know how to ask you can get most any result you wish.

Even moving like a western pleasure horse. I'd love to see them! Anyone want to see some really poor riding on an ASB?

Check out www. Check out the little black dude on the sorrel horse. NICE equitation. Now I'm going to take a moment to brag.

The girl in the off-white linen coat riding the all black gelding is my "student," of sorts. I have been coaching her for the past two weeks, and they are a phenomenal team.

They placed very well in all their classes and I was SO proud. This horse went from gadgets and gimmick training without soring--his owner was VERY specific about that to all natural and barefoot.

He is going to really be a contender when we get more excercise and discipline under his belt! Okay, done bragging. Katphoti - Aw, congrats Checked out the ASB class pics you were talking about The best pics of my two kids are in the Fri.

The chestnut arab with the button braids is mine, and so is the little bay arab - her rider is a blonde girl with glasses :- Both of them usually show sport horse classes, but they do pretty well in HP and Eq too.

It's funny In the classes that they owned, the pics sucked. Oh well Ok, I take that back Y'know what's funny? I, too, miss old-school appys.

Yes, a little swishy, but that's okay! I think they look amazing on their horses. Great hands, great seats! I wish the photographer hadn't gotten so many photos when they're on the up of their post.

It looks like there was some good competition in the class. Plus they were up against Michael of White Star Stables, and he's a wonderful rider.

Honestly, he is so good to his horses--he has really nice hands. I just wish he didn't use so many gadgets and gimmicks. To all, the woman in photo of that class is riding a Gypsy Vanner stallion, and she is SO mean to him.

He is so unhappy because of it. She's got a death grip with her hands and spurs him way too much. I watched them ride at the Festival of Horses, where I met my mare's future "husband," a classy Percheron stallion.

She was working her stallion in the ring before going to her stallion showcase, and they came in with that GV.

She was tugging on him and smacking him, and he was so unhappy. The owner kept saying "he's a stallion, you've got to expect that kind of behavior out of him.

When the Percheron stallion in the middle of the arena being ridden in a bitless bridle and bareback is completely quiet?

I wonder what the stallion's temperament is REALLY like--he probably has a crappy temperament because he has a crappy owner and a crappy rider!

Sounds like the ApHC just bragging on themselves. I agree with you JR and catty. It's so sad how so many breeds have lost their original look, temperament, and quality of movement.

I am so proud of those kiddos I was relieved - he was kinda ginormous to be having a major malfunction in the Equidome while my kids were riding in there.

So many abbreviations!!! I have no idea what is what:- Stop the drugging or horses people.. The people that are caught End of story.

Steve Asmussen horse racing These people are a disgrace to the horse world. She looked very nice. For those who weren't there, the judge was on top of it and practiced zero tolerance.

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Planning Weitere Artikel zu diesem Thema. Q Western Pleasure Novice Amateur anschl. Details Showrecord auf Anfrage! Q Senior Western Riding Open anschl. Und gewinnt davon dann vielleicht drei. OK Abbrechen.

Pleasure Horse Forum Video

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